DeleD Community Edition

Paul-Jan

If you haven't been living under a rock for the past week, you might have picked up the news that DeleD is going Open source.

However, we need to decide what Open Source license to apply.

Here is a bunch of choices:

http://www.opensource.org/licenses/category

Basically, we want a very non-restrictive license. It would be nice if it would prevent companies from simply copy-pasting and reselling the code, but much more important is that it doesn't restrict people in contributing to the project in any way.

The only technical restriction is that the license must be supported by SourceForge... however, that's not much of a restriction, as sourceforge supports a heap of licenses, and is open to new additions if they make sense.

So speak up, people, what should we do? It would be great if we could get a little discussion going here! Here are some things to consider:

- Should people using modified versions of the code be force to contribute those modifications? (MPL v.s. BSD)
- Should people be forced to open source their application if they use part of the DeleD code base? (GPL v.s. the world)
- Should we consider dual licensing from the start?
- etc.

Thanks for your input, everyone!

paul_nicholls · Posted: Sat Nov 14, 2009 10:21 am Post subject:

Licensing, hmm....

I don't really understand them (or know if they are applicable in THIS instance), but I know of these two:

1. modified library gnu public license (LGPL) (http://freepascal.org/faq.var#general-license) which is used by the freepascal compiler (www.freepascal.org), and the corresponding IDE Lazarus (www.lazarus.freepascal.org)

2. Mozilla Public License 1.1 (http://opensource.org/licenses/mozilla1.1.php)

One project, tiOPF (http://tiopf.sourceforge.net/), an Open Source framework for Delphi & Free Pascal is dual licensed (http://wiki.freepascal.org/tiOPF#License), and you can choose from either of the above 2 licenses

cheers,
Paul
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trucker2000 · Posted: Sat Nov 14, 2009 1:00 pm Post subject:

Starnick · DeleD PRO user Joined: 28 Jul 2007 Posts: 611

Daaark · Posted: Sun Nov 15, 2009 9:14 am Post subject:

I agree with Starnick.

GNU, and all GNU derived or styled licenses are useless. BSD, MIT, or even MS-PL style licenses are truer to the spirit of open, collaborative projects.
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Grandmaster B · DeleD PRO user Joined: 03 Jul 2007 Posts: 218

Please take in mind that DeleD is a application not a library or engine!

With GPL (LGPL is nonsense here) they usually do not rip of pieces of the software or make branching projects, they contribute to the original project and concentrate on improving it. This makes sense to stand-alone applications where you dont want to share code or libraries. Of course all changes or modifications must be released under the GPL and can be merged back into the project! With the GPL you cannot copy&paste code into your own project without making it GPL too - so the people will most probably improve the original software!

With licenses like BSD and MIT one can change or improve the code without contributing the changes back to the original project. And he can make his version commercial. Short speaking, DeleD will probably be ripped into pieces or become obsolete from branching commercial projects - for example. BSD is only reasonable for code libraries. ZLIB is even worse. You can put DeleD in public domain - its effectively the same!

The GPL makes sense for DeleD, it protects the software from selfish code harvesters and leaves the door open for contributions. And contributors are forced to collaborate more.

If you choose a license take the GPL or one thats in the spirit of the GPL. If you dont believe me take a look at some popular GPL projects, if they are worth it, they do very well!

EDIT: I also think, if DeleD is released under GPL, it can insert code from other GPL projects without trouble. This is something to investigate!

paul_nicholls · Posted: Wed Nov 18, 2009 9:29 am Post subject:

Grandmaster B · DeleD PRO user Joined: 03 Jul 2007 Posts: 218

Thanks for you vote Wink

Another interesting possibility for GPLed projects is:

A company needs a dedicated level editor, they modify and use DeleD. Now they decide to put the modified DeleD level editor for modders on the retail CD, they just have to release the modified source code and all is fine! DeleD can benefit from the publicity and the improvements.

Its still possbile to modify, rebrand and sell DeleD this way but not without crediting the original software and not without releasing the source. And under this conditions it doesnt make much sense.

Nocturn · DeleD PRO user Joined: 08 Aug 2004 Posts: 635

I agree with Starnick too, i would definatley tend to BSD.

Paul-Jan · Posted: Sun Nov 22, 2009 10:35 am Post subject:

This is a great discussion, guys.

Personally, I´d also tend towards BSD, simply because I´m a professional programmer who´s life is often bugged by GPL.

I do think Grandmaster B is making some very valid points.

On the other hand, if Jeroen had stated from the beginning that "anything I create for DeleD I cannot re-use in any closed commercial projects of my own", I think I might have been a lot less enthousiastic of "doing the Delgine thing". Surely I'm not the only one with negative (probably non-rational, yes) emotions towards GPL-like conditions.

The one and only goal of the license should be to stimulate users to contribute to the project, and keep it alive (or "take it to the next level", or however you'd like to phrase it). I don't really care if people rip off the project, as long as we get active developers on DeleD CE in exchange.

Grandmaster B · DeleD PRO user Joined: 03 Jul 2007 Posts: 218

What about dual licensing BSD and GPL?

Starnick · DeleD PRO user Joined: 28 Jul 2007 Posts: 611

I'd say just keep it simple.

erwincoumans · Member Joined: 10 Dec 2006 Posts: 2

Go for a BSD or Zlib style license, it will make your project more wide spread and attractive.

Cheers,
Erwin

adr · Member Joined: 23 Jul 2005 Posts: 165

I had a little talk with Jeroen about going open soruce. I think its a greate idea, but how are they going to keep up the cost for running a website, ftp, and a fourm if deled went free of charge? He said maybe they could have some sorta donation setup for users to donate to the site to pay off running it. Downside to donations is unless people have a need, they wont. So maybe look into have 2 linces that could fit both open source for coding help, and maybe a bus type one? It'll work like the light and pro- just the pro linces will have a little more freedom on what you can do with the models vs the free one? (I know alot of users will get mad at me for saying that, but you have to have some sorta way to fund a open sorc some how if you know what I mean.)

Either way, it's a win for us users ^^;

Mr.Fletcher · Posted: Mon Dec 07, 2009 9:59 pm Post subject:

How high is the cost for running a website + forum today?
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