DeleD Community Edition

[Fallen]

I like the engine at first glance, seems nice and clean, but I have some questions being new to this editor. Ill run a few questions by here.


Scaling texture sizes, whats the deal here, every time I try and scale the texture comes out massive, no matter what I key in, how does this work.


Optimization, I will be exporting to Torque, I left BSP behind a long time ago, now I find myself going back to it for this project, perhaps this is best for the Torque boards as I am new to that program, whats best lots of objects or one big one, example castle wall with turrets, one wall and lots of individual squares for the turrets, or one big mesh with all of it as one object, wall and turret squares all one object.


Selecting more than one face, you can select one, but what about selecting more than one face when in polygon mode.

optimization?
What I want to do here is weld edges, when one uses certain CAD programs when its imported into other programs we get tiny minute splits in the side of edges, we can load this into Maya or Max and weld the edges, but if I can do it in this it saves me a job and makes my pipeline quicker, so I am wondering if this program has some optimization that will save me exporting into an out side 3d modeller, Id have a fiddle in Delgine but I cannot select more than 2 faces,

What are split edges? basically imagine a cube, now imaging all the edges are not attached, you cannot see it by eye, but its there, so If you select a face and moved it, the face would come away from the model, its not attached, it really looks like it is, but it isn't, like I said we can weld the edges in a 3d program, but Id like to save loading it into a 3d program and do everything in Delgine, that would save me loading hundreds of models into Maya if I could do the whole thing in this editor.

[Mr.Fletcher]

Hello Fallen,

"Scaling texture sizes, whats the deal here, every time I try and scale the texture comes out massive, no matter what I key in, how does this work. "
You probably still entered the wrong values. For scaling, you have two choices: If you want to make the texture "smaller" (=tile more often), enter a greater value than 100 (%). If you want to make it "bigger" (=tile less often), enter a value below 100.

"Selecting more than one face, you can select one, but what about selecting more than one face when in polygon mode. "
Press shift+ctrl to add polygons to your selection. You can also drag a frame around a bunch of polygons.

Weld edges:
What the other 3D programs do is probably the same thing as DeleD does with vertices. To weld an "edge", like you said, Select the "two" (4) vertices and use the weld command. You will need to enter a value for the maximum distance or keep the default value. This depends on your scene. If there is a value of 10, then all vertices that are closer or equal than 10 units away from each other will be welded to a single vertex.

If you need further explanation to this, just ask
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[trucker2000]

[Fallen]

Ill test those answers out now, just a quick question while I am doing that.
I am looking at Torque to export my game into, so I'm looking at the conversion process and how it likes to work, now looking at optimization.

Does torque like its map objects as one big mesh or lots of small ones?

For example say we wanted a maze for a map, we could make it as one big mesh, the whole thing just one solid object. Or we could do it as lots of separate objects for all the walls, what works best for optimization in Torque.

Welding edges, I see that is only available in the pro version, Ill have to buy this to test, Ill have to look into paypal for this.

Just looking at paypal, on the buy page to send by paypal you have to enter a card number, if to send money by paypal, you need a card then whats the point of paypal, just send it by the card, that service makes no sense at all.

It is a good idea to have an account in UK GBP, a third of the worlds games are from the UK, as this is a product for games designers it makes sense to have a business account for UK GBP.

I never use cards so I am going to have to go to the bank apply for one, fill in the forms and wait for it to come though, much easier if you had an account in sterling and one could just bung a cheque in the post. Or have a 30 day trail so you can test all of the editor.
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[Mr.Fletcher]

[Jeroen]

Hi there Fallen, and welcome to these forums!

[Fallen]

Yep you are right on the vertex weld, Im still testing this editor but it is coming along very well, I just wish Id had this years ago if what I am seeing so far keeps working, I could of saved so much time on old projects from years back.

I just want to test my scaling right, so for torque uses, what is the scale from delgine to Torque, what's one unit in delgine, is 16 units one foot, so say I wanted a figure of a man to be 6 foot tall would that be 16 delgine units = 1 foot 16 x 6 = 96 units in delgine, convert it to torque and it will be a 6 feet tall figure.

This is so I can match my scale right for import into Delgine and then out into Torque.
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[Paul-Jan]

With the default scale settings ("1"), 32 units inside DeleD equals 1 meter inside Torque. For convenience, you can press "4" to set the grid to 32 units inside DeleD.

Note: The definition of the exporter's scale setting will probably change with the next version of the exporter. Currently it actually scales the geometry, but in the future it will directly map onto the geometry_scale property inside the .map file (which is 32 by default), as some users pointed out would make more sense. The new exporter will automatically change the settings to match the old scale.

[Fallen]

So the closest we can get it roughly would be 12 units = 1 foot, you could do it better we want to use multiples like 4,8,16,32,64 etc, it makes things easier when setting the grid up.

I think its easier if I say 16 units = 1 foot and set up tourque under that scale.

Ill make some stuff for Torque, port it and see what happens.
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[trucker2000]

[Fallen]

lets say we had a T junction corridor,
if we cut it up, so its all the wall sections as every individual wall rather than all one object we will have the sections that are hidden, but if its one object we wont, if that makes any sense, so wouldn't this be bad

Say a floor with wall on it, if its 2 objects we have the reversed side, ie the walls under side that is touching the floor, but if its all one object we don't have that as its joined to the floor, so doesn't having lots of objects slow it down due to having extra faces that would of been joined to the rest of the model.
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[trucker2000]

I've tried merging objects with the old exporter and it always crashed. When I've built, I've had to use seperate objects. (IE:wall, floor, etc...)
I haven't had a chance to use the new exporter yet, so I don't know if that has been fixed yet. You can try it and see. Torque renders the "dif" as one object. So I don't know if it will make any difference. Careful use of portals help in rendering as well.
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[Fallen]

Yea portals should optomize a lot, you say it renders as one object, that seems odd to me, surley it just draws what is in view, all be it with what optomization is used to limit what it draws. Ill have to see if Torque has a fps and ill do a walk around the level and see how they compare as one big mesh or lots of seperate ones.
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[trucker2000]

To display the fps, while in-game, press the tilde ( ~ ) key and type in MetricFps(); and it will show you the fps of the scene.
Torque is a complicated engine with a lot of stuff it does to optimise the scene. As you suggested, it only renders what you can "see". There are LOD things you can do to help it out as well. Such as making several different detail levels of an object. I've never done this, so couldn't help in figureing it out.
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Some day I will grow up and be a real modeler.
"Never give up! Never surrender!!"
Sys specs:
asus
8 gigs ram
Invidia gtx560 video card
Windows 8 (worst op sys Ever)

[kaylon]